Ousted ‘The Traitors’ Contestant on Learning He’s ‘Not the Best Judge of Character’ and Watching Michael Rapaport Become the ‘Center of Attention’ (EXCLUSIVE)

SPOILER ALERT: This post contains spoilers from the first three episodes of “The Traitors” Season 4, now streaming on Peacock.

It’s been more than 20 years since Rob Cesternino played mind games on television, but on Thursday night, the “Survivor” star returned to competition on Season 4 of “The Traitors.” Unfortunately, his TV debut didn’t last long, since the Traitors decided to murder him second, after “Big Brother” favorite Ian Terry.

This season introduced a new twist to the game; Alan Cumming revealed to one player during the premiere that they would be a secret Traitor. Each night, that person would get to give the other Traitors a shortlist with options of who they could kill. During the second episode, Traitors Lisa Rinna, Candiace Dillard and Rob Rauches were given a chance to find out the secret Traitor’s identity. To do so, they had to successfully commit a murder in plain sight; the Traitors had to obtain a stack of tarot cards from the kitchen, with each card representing a player. They must then choose who to murder and burn that card.

Candiace chose to start a conga line to distract the rest of the cast while Rob R. snuck in and grabbed the cards, sharing them with Rinna. Together, they chose Rob C. and burned the card, without telling Candiace. She was thrilled, however, when she found out, because shortly after the conga line ended, Rob C. told her that he had a feeling the Traitors were doing a killing in plain sight. The Traitors didn’t have the chance to come face to face with the secret Traitor, because it was instead revealed during the banishing that night: Donna Kelce was the secret Traitor — and the house called her on it, sending her home.

Rob C. has been part of the reality world for quite some time; he first appeared on “Survivor: The Amazon” in 2003, coming in third place. He returned the following year for “Survivor: All Stars,” but was voted out third. While he’s never won the game, he’s known as one of the best gamers ever to play — and has since made a lucrative career out of his adoration of reality television.

In 2010, Cesternino launched “Rob Has a Podcast,” also known as RHAP, a platform that recaps and analyzes reality TV — specifically, “Survivor,” “Big Brother” and “The Amazing Race.” The network began as recaps, but grew to also begin featuring commentary, interviews and community events for all sorts of reality TV loyalists. Later this year, he’ll release a book about “Survivor,” titled “The Tribe Has Spoken,” which he delves into below.

Here, Cesternino talks about his surprise over being murdered, not banished; what he learned from his “Traitors” experience — and whether this means more reality TV appearances are in his future.

You’re known for being a great gamer. Did you worry you’d have a target on you from the start?

I was very concerned that I was going to be banished. I was really worried after Boston Rob came and played such a great game in Season 3. I felt like people would look at me and my background from “Survivor” and from podcasting, and say, “I don’t trust him,” and they would want to banish me right out of the gate. I really was very worried about that. I guess I was pleasantly surprised that people did not seem to be too suspicious of me… except for the Traitors. Everyone else, I think, liked me!

When did you find out who the Traitors were, and how did you react?

After you’re out of the game, you are told by the producers who the Traitors are, and maybe they’ll show that at some point. I was surprised who the Traitors were. I definitely thought it was a Housewife, but I thought it was Dorinda Medley. It made so much sense for her to come back and make her a Traitor, and she was so calm. Dorinda is super Zen now! Since when? She was so different than last season, so I really thought she was so calm and collected now because she is a Traitor.

I was going to say, you shouldn’t have said there was a murder happening in plain sight in front of Candiace. But ultimately, it didn’t even matter because she didn’t even get to tell her fellow Traitors. They murdered you anyway!

I am glad that I did say it to Candiace, so at least I could put a little fear in her — that she would know what it was like to be on the receiving end of being under threat. But yeah, that was a big surprise to me. I had a good relationship with Candiace, and I felt like, “Here’s one of my friends, I’ve gotta warn my friends about what’s going on.”

Did you make many alliances while there?

I felt very close to Tiffany Mitchell from “Big Brother,” and I felt like she was another smart, social player that I really could have worked with. I also felt very close to Monét X Change, who was in my car to start with. Monét was another person I really had a lot of trust in. I felt like Monét was definitely a Faithful.

Talking about the cast, I was shocked that Michael Rapaport was cast, and he may be the most annoying person to play the game. How was it in the house with him?

Listen, does Michael Rapaport know how to get screen time, though?

I mean, I guess that’s true.

To me, I thought that Michael Rapaport was such an interesting obstacle. Everything else aside, he was such a center of attention. I felt instantly that there’s no way Michael Rapaport is a Traitor. No Traitor would ever act like this. And I had separate conversations with Lisa, Candiace and even Rob. I said to Lisa, “You know him. He’s around all the Bravo stuff. Is he like this?” And she said, “He’s a very good actor.” I said, “Is he a 24/7, method actor, Lisa?!” I think the Traitors were really trying to push very hard that Michael Rapaport is a Traitor, and I think it ultimately didn’t help me that I was very vocal, saying Michael Rapaport is not a Traitor, but I said he needed to go because I felt that he was a big problem in terms of helping the Faithful. He was always going to be a distraction.

Completely. I was shocked he was still there three episodes in.

But the Traitors like having that kind of distraction!

What did you learn during your time on “The Traitors”?

I learned so much about myself throughout this whole process. I think that what I learned is that I am not necessarily the best judge of character, but I am a good judge of people’s actions. I should pay a little bit more attention to what people are doing, because unfortunately and fortunately, I like almost everybody that I meet. I really am a very trusting person, and I think I just need to be a little bit more perceptive about some of the people that I meet.

Who do you think is playing the best game so far?

I was really impressed with all of the Traitors on our season. A lot of times, they have a Traitor who’s a real wild card; you’ll see the other two Traitors asking how they’re going to deal with that person. I don’t know if they thought maybe Lisa or Candiace or Rob was going to be a wild card, but I’ve been really proud of them in terms of just how well they’ve worked together. They’ve been playing really, really smart, and I’m waiting to see if the Faithful can counterpunch.

So true! So, you’ve done two seasons of “Survivor” but also have an encyclopedia of knowledge in gaming. How did this game compare to “Survivor”?

This was so fun. I’ve spent my entire career talking about “Survivor,” and that is its own animal, but “The Traitors” is just such a phenomenon. I was just so appreciative that I got the chance to go and participate in this wild murder mystery that is so exciting to watch, and I get to be a part of that world too, and now actually have a little bit more of a sense of how it all works to podcast about it. So it was just such a treat for me.

I think “Survivor” is harder in terms of just the physicality. However, it’s a real mind F-, “The Traitors.” So ultimately, I did not get to experience where “Traitors” gets really hard, and there are real betrayals that go on in every season of the show.

I have to ask about your upcoming book, “The Tribe Has Spoken,” about “Survivor.” Why did you want to dive into this now?

So, 25 years of “Survivor,” it felt like the right time. I’ve had this really interesting ride with the show where I was a huge super fan, and then I was a player, and then I became this podcaster who has really been there for like 60% of the show’s history now at this point. I don’t think anybody has ever told the story of “Survivor” as it has gone through its own evolution, from where we started in Borneo in the year 2000 to where we are in the new era and what they’re doing in “Survivor” 50. And I just thought that it was going to be super fun for a “Survivor” fan to go back with me through that journey, from where it started, from where I started, cataloging all of the great historical moments and all of the iconic players that are almost sort of like Greek gods, in terms of the mythology of “Survivor.” It’s just a real treasure trove of all the “Survivor” information that I have, and I wanted to put it on paper for people.

So, as someone who has watched from the beginning, we’ll get to celebrate the show?

This is a love letter to “Survivor,” and it’s really a show that changed my life in so many ways — to go from an unemployed college student who discovered this thing in 2000 and really every good thing to come into my life, including “The Traitors,” was part of “Survivor” taking me in. I’ve always just been so in love with all of these shows and these formats, and I’m always very excited to talk about how passionate I am about these things.

How do you feel about “Survivor” 50 coming up?

How could you not be excited about “Survivor” 50 and all of the spectacle that’s going to be around? And they took some big swings, they took some wild swings, and we’ll see how they’re going to turn out. Most of the “Survivor” fans that I’ve talked to are very excited about the legends that are coming back and the chance to see some of these old-school players come back onto their screens. It’s been so long since we’ve had returning players back on “Survivor,” so almost all the fans that I talked to are very excited, and if anything, they’re just nervous that they might screw it up.

Do you want to dive into other shows — via podcasting about them or competing on them?

“Big Brother” was where I started my journey; I applied to be on “Big Brother 3,” and did not get selected, and that’s how I got into the “Survivor” casting cycle. I think “Big Brother” is fun, but it’s so long. It’s a very long commitment. I’ll listen if the phone rings.

This interview has been edited and condensed.